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Tags: k, k2, micronutrients, vitamink, vitamink2
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Hi Chris,I am in the process of getting dental implants but the bone graft I had done 4 months ago is not hardening as I hoped and was wondering if k2 with d3 would help.
Thank you -
I imagine it would, since K2 regulates calcium metabolism and directs it to the bones and teeth rather than the soft tissues.
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Natto (fermented soy beans) would seem like the perfect source for vitamin k2… However, isn’t soy particularly bad?
https://thehealthyskeptic.org/tag/soy
I’m guessing blood tests could be done to check k2 levels.. what would be a healthy number to shoot for? -
Unfermented soy is bad. Fermented soy is fine in moderation. Natto is indeed the best source of K2, but most people can’t tolerate the taste.
I haven’t heard of a reliable blood test for K2.
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Tried natto, didn’t like the taste
Did find perhaps some k2 source alternatives:
http://www.thorne.com/Products/Vitamins/prd~K170.jsp
http://www.greenpasture.org/retail/?t=products&p=products&a=display&i=1000
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Either of those would be fine. Thorne and GP are both good companies.
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Neither has K2 in the MK7 form that comes from fermentation (natto etc)… they both contain K2 of the MK4 type (i.e. K2 that’s been synthesized by animal tissues)
So that begs the question, which is better MK4 vs. MK7?
Jarrow for example has an MK7 supplement: http://www.jarrow.com/product/241/MK_7
Interesting Study cited in this thread: http://www.imminst.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=25651 -
That’s a controversial topic, Ben. MK4 is the form synthesized from K1 by humans for their own use. Although they’re similar in function, MK-4 has effects on gene expression in bone tissue that MK-7 doesn’t have. I recommend using MK4 for this reason. See this post for more information.
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Yes, according to that great post, it does seem that the effective of MK-7 has not been studied yet…
The comments to the post were also great, someone pointed out that Life Extension has one product with both MK-4 (1mg) and MK-7 (1ug)! So I think that might be a good way to hedge my bet!
http://www.lef.org/Vitamins-Supplements/Item01224/Super-K-with-Advanced-K2-Complex.html -
Hi Chris,
I am thinking of adding K2 to my vitamin regimen. I have been taking over the counter calcium with vit. D for over 30 years which was prescribed when I had lupus. It has been gone for 20 years but I still take calcium for mild osteopenia. Over the years, I have developed many calcium deposits in my thighs and torso. The doctors say it is nothing to worry about and they have no answer as to how to stop them or get rid of them. Do you think the K2 might possibly help to get rid of the calcium deposits or keep new ones from occuring. Also I eat a lot of store made saurekraut, not canned. It is considered fermented? I also eat 8-10 Egglands free range eggs a week. Do you think the sauerkraut and eggs might provide enough K2 without the need to supplement?
Thanks for any advice. -
Patti,
Sauerkraut must be raw in order to be of benefit. The stuff they sell in normal supermarkets is pasteurized, which kills the beneficial bacteria. Health food stores in many areas do sell raw sauerkraut, or even better, you can make it yourself and save a ton of money.
Eggs – even “free-range” supermarket eggs – are not as high in K2 as some fermented foods like natto and hard cheese. Butter is another good source, but it must come from grass-fed cows, and that’s not easy to find in some places.
With your history you might consider the fermented cod liver oil / butter oil blend from Green Pastures. It has vitamin D, vitamin A and vitamin K2 as well as EPA and DHA together. It’s actually one of the few maintenance supplements I recommend everyone take, because of the balance of nutrients it contains. A, D & K2 work synergistically to promote healthy bones.
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Thanks Chris. I will look at their website. You say this one of the few supplements you recommend everyone take. Are there others and, if so, what?
On a totally unrelated issue, I have had low WBC counts for the last 10 years, possibly more, and it is low enough that doctors wanted to find a cause but, as yet, have not found one. Do you have any knowledge on this? My internet searches have not helped me and I’m not sure I should even be too concerned about it. One person said that low WBC are not a diagnosis but simply a lab result that might have meaning, so don’t worry about it. Do you have any thoughts?
Patti
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It depends on the person. For the average, generally healthy person the fermented cod liver oil / butter oil blend is it. Magnesium is difficult to get with a paleo/primal type diet, which is often what I suggest people follow, and many people are deficient in it so I may suggest that as well. Overall my preference is always to obtain the nutrients we need from food, or at least food-based products like cod liver oil, when possible.
Low WBC may indicate a chronic viral or bacterial infection, or it may simply be genetic. If you’ve low WBC your whole life, and you aren’t symptomatic, I wouldn’t worry about it.
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I’ve just come across your site & this thread on K2. I wonder if you’d share you thoughts on a a bit of a challenge we face at times in my health food store — how to best inform people who are taking blood-thinning drugs about the benefits of K2. We now just suggest that they ask their doctor about how to balance the K2 & the warfarin. We realize of course that virtually no PCP’s are informed on this.
I myself take K2 & D3 daily, to help stop my body from taking calcium from my bones & then depositing it in joints, etc.
Thanks. -
There are studies demonstrating that rats treated with high doses of warfarin develop arterial calcification, and that K2 protects against this. It can be speculated that humans who take warfarin also develop some degree of calcifications in their arteries, predisposing these patients to heart attacks and strokes. Unfortunately I haven’t seen human studies confirming this. On the other hand, the Rotterdam Study showed that K2 intake is associated with a significant reduction in CVD. And this study shows that K2 does prevent arterial calcification. So, although we don’t yet have all of the research we’d like to have on this subject, I think you can piece together a pretty strong argument for taking K2 with warfarin. The caveat is that K2 will probably lower the INR to some degree, so the PCP would need to monitor that.
You could also educate them on using EPA & DHA at high doses as an alternative to warfarin. Studies have shown similar CVD-preventative effects, and of course EPA & DHA have benefits warfarin doesn’t have.
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A synthetic k2 (mk-7 only) that is more absorbable?
http://www.nutraingredients.com/Industry/New-source-of-vitamin-K2-hits-the-market -
I am on a Calcium, Vitamin D supplement for thinning bones. It also has 45mcg of vitamin K2. Does this cause blood clots, since that what I understand vit K does?
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Vitamin K2 and vitamin K have different effects. K2 primarily regulates calcium metabolism (i.e. makes sure calcium goes into the bones and teeth where it belongs and not the soft tissue), whereas vitamin K has a stronger effect on coagulation.
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Chris, thanks for your information on K2. I am researaching benefits of K2 for my situation. I did not have osteoporosis until I had been on Advair for a few years for COPD from chronic bronchitis. I have been on Actonel for 1 yr and 7 months. Just had a bone density test that showed I have declined again, 12%. Now at -3.3. I have taken calcium supplements for most of my adult life and have been taking D3 and magnesium for several years. I have a history of DVT, so I take Persantine, which is not a blood thinner, but keeps my platelets from sticking together. I transitioned to vegan and have been free of animal products for one year. I do not eat the high fat raw, but try to eat mostly fruit, veggies, legumes, and small amount of whole grains and try to keep fats low (nuts and EVO). I am wondering if 1) K2 is right for me, 2) if my diet contributed to the bad report, 3) would K2 help if I still have to take Advair (steroids). Would Kefir have K2? What about rejuvalac?
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Ann: I don’t advocate a vegan diet for multiple reasons, and this is one of them. It’s impossible to get the nutrients (from food) necessary for optimal health with a vegan diet. I’ve written about that elsewhere on the blog. My recommendation for dealing with your problem would include a diet rich in grass-fed animal products, fermented cod liver oil (supplying A, D, K2, E and other quinones in their natural, whole-food form), and regular consumption of whole, fatty fish like salmon. K2 is certainly right for you, as is a whole-food form of D and A. Kefir probably does have some K2, since it’s fermented – especially if made with milk from grass-fed cows. Sauerkraut is another potential source.
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Chris, thank you for you reply. This info has helped. I will make diet changes. I know that I am not getting enough calories with vegan diet, but in going low-fat vegan, I was trying to lower cholesterol which has been high for years; plus, acidic animal foods supposedly make osteooporosis worse. I am allergic to seafood, so can’t do fish or cod liver oil. I do have Ann Wigmore’s books with instructions on how to make sauerkraut. It is not easy to find the right way to eat to obain better health. This blog has offered more information that just reading an article would not provide. Thanks again!
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There’s no need to lower cholesterol in most cases. Read these articles and watch the videos. https://thehealthyskeptic.org/heartdisease
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Hello, Chris! I just started taking the TriK Vitamin K supplement, and was wondering if the multi-vitamin that I am taking offers sufficient D3 (5,000 IU) and A (5,000 IU) to aid in absorption? I also take a Krill Oil supplement once daily. I am taking the supplement becuase I am genetically predisposed to heart problems and osteoperosis (both sides of the family) – I am 30 but don’t want to take any chances with problems down the line. Just wondering if this is a good idea? Thanks for your time!!
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You should be fine. I prefer getting A & D from natural, whole food sources like fermented cod liver oil (from Green Pasture), but in terms of dosage you’re fine with 5,000 IU of both.
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Awesome! Thanks for your reply! Would the fermented cod liver oil replace the Krill Oil? And, if I switched to that could I still take my multi-vitamin? The multi-vitamin is a whole food one.
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Yes, it would replace the krill oil. I’m not big on multivitamins. Read why.
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Great, thanks again for the information!!
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